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Delta Turns Flight Around After Multiple Passengers Refuse to Wear Masks

eklendi
 
Details are emerging over why a Delta Air Lines flight to Atlanta was turned around and returned to Detroit on Thursday, and once again face masks are the issue. According to reports, two passengers refused to wear face masks during the flight – a mandate for virtually every airline – and the plane returned to Detroit Metro Airport in suburban Romulus. A Delta spokesperson told the MLive.com media outlet that the flight was delayed because the passengers “were non-compliant with crew… (www.msn.com) Daha Fazlası...

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alan75035
alan75035 40
"Don't make me turn around this airplane..."!
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 2

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TimDyck
Tim Dyck 27
Weather they work or not is irrelevant. We could discuss that all day and present facts and links from both sides but that will not change the policy so it is just a waste of time. The policy says you wear a mask so you wear a mask, if you don't like it you don't fly.
gmoreland
Gregory Moreland 2
This has nothing to do with the weather.
737man
737man 1
This is the most even keeled response I've heard in weeks. Yes, it is what it is.
PDLanum
Philip Lanum 17
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.
thineprof
Why the hell curtail it? The virus is here to stay just like influenze and rhino virus (causing common colds). You gonna wear masks your whole damned life?
gstevenjones
Gary Jones 5
...said the guy with no deaths in the family from covid-19.
gmoreland
Gregory Moreland -1
Said the guy who apparently has no idea how many deaths influenza causes and yet never wore a mask for that.
AWAAlum
AWAAlum 1
Apples and oranges.
yr2012
matt jensen -9
we never wore them in combat situations
nk4091
Neil Klapthor 9
Combat? I agree commercial air travel has become a miserable experience, but, seriously, what are you talking about?
tranderson2
Tommy Boy 1
Is this a combat situation? You probably should have worn them and it wouldn't hurt you if you did.
tomasz2013
Nice analogy about the diaper. I suppose you never used them to CONTAIN all the crap that comes out of babies. Your house most have smelled something crazy. But if we're lucky, you dont have any offspring and your moronic views will not be passed on.
CHBHA
CB HARDY 1
The man in Arizona that had his penis amputated because of Covid felt the same way.
cyberjet
cyberjet -3
This from an expert in “ useless”. I weep for your offspring.
jm21783
James Meek 0
No, the WHO <b><i>did not</i></b> say asymptomatic people are barely contagious. That was a FUBAR instance of a scientist's poorly worded comment being quoted out of context.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/16/health/gupta-coronavirus-podcast-wellness-june-16/index.html
Studies have also shown that people may be most contagious just before they start to show symptoms.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/what-the-who-meant-to-say-about-asymptomatic-people-spreading-the-coronavirus

Also, the virus is present in the upper respiratory tract, so it appears that it can spread simply through, as Ryan put it during the event, “singing, speaking loudly, exertion, maybe in a gym . . . shouting in a night club because you can’t hear your friend.” (Coughing and sneezing, of course, are likely to spread virus-bearing droplets farther through the air, which is a reason that symptomatic patients could infect more people; an unanswered question is how much each group drives the pandemic.) Someone might go to a restaurant “feeling O.K.,” but their “viral load could be actually quite high.” (In a key epidemiological study showing how the virus spread from table to table in a restaurant in China, the initial patient didn’t report symptoms until hours after having eaten there.) Ryan emphasized that this was a reason for wearing masks. “There is this period of time when, you know, even a professor of infectious diseases themselves wouldn’t know that I’m getting covid,” Ryan said. “There is that hours or days in which you’re not that unwell, or you could be becoming unwell, you’re not aware of your status, and it’s because the disease can spread at that moment that the disease is so contagious. That’s why it’s spread around the world in such an uncontained way. It’s because it’s hard to stop this virus.”
skyddog
skyddog 72
Flying is not a "right". It's a privilege. This applies to pilots, crew, and PASSENGERS (as well as cargo, for that matter).

Once you board a commercial flight, you are under federal jurisdiction. Better pay attention and obey the laws.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 19
That is the point most people forget. Weather you agree with wearing a mask if disagree with wearing a mask if the airline says you must wear a mask to fly in their plane then you have to wear it.
n82221
Dave Hahn 25
Excellent comment. In this country it has become commonplace to think of everything as a “ right” when in fact most are just privileges which many abuse
DaveIsaacs
David Isaacs 96
Glad to see Delta has the courage to show they meant it even if it was expensive.
flightcan
Adi Rabadi 34
They should and hope they would - send the bill to the passengers that caused the turn around.
ynotssor
ynot ssor 0
@Adi Rabadi opined "... send the bill to the passengers that caused the turn around." That might require a class-action lawsuit from both Delta and the other passengers that suffered from the KATL arrival delay, but some ACLU lawyer might be willing to take the case.

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PDLanum
Philip Lanum 6
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.
Again.
AWAAlum
AWAAlum 1
Surgeons wear masks to protect both the patients and themselves. But perhaps this new virus's particles are smaller than those that came before it, and are able to penetrate a mask. Just a guess.
beilstwh
beilstwh 23
cut and pasting the same comment over and over still doesn't make it true, it just shows ignorance
AbieshanG13
They could've lost a lot of money, but, we ought to understand that the health and safety of passengers have greater precedence over money, in this situation.
Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling 10
They need to sue the passengers for the cost of the return and flight cost to get back to where the plane was when it turned around. But make it a state court case so the president can't pardon them.

It would be so much better if this malignant administration had taken this seriously from the beginning. Imagine how many people would still be alive.

As of a few days ago, the coffins of the dead would be 193 miles long end to end, 65 miles side to side, and 53 miles tall stacked. And if the official numbers ARE 28% low, the true numbers could be 247 miles long, 83 miles wife, and 68 miles tall.

If this is 'prolife', I don't get it. So many needlessly dead.
dtgriscom
Daniel Griscom 4
Sorry to be pedantic, but that should be 193 miles long end to end, 65 miles side to side, ***OR*** 53 miles tall stacked. Yes, way too many people have died, and their coffins would make a horrifying line (in any direction), but a cube that size would hold about 400,000 times the population of the entire world.
wdfarmer
Wayne Farmer 1
Based on a standard coffin size of 84 in. long x 28 in. wide x 23 in. tall, and multiplying that by 674,038 global deaths, my calculations have them occupying just 0.395 square miles if they're not stacked. Am I right?
wdfarmer
Wayne Farmer 1
Never mind. I didn't read Daniel Griscom's reply properly. If we're counting just US deaths, now 152878, then all the coffins laid end-to-end would form a line 202.7 miles long.
Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling -5
148,056 have died, so the 'mileage' I posted is short.

197 miles long. 66 miles wide, and 54 miles tall. With a possible 28% undercount, it could be as long as 252 miles, 84 miles wide, and 69 miles high.

The majority did not have to die. Again, THE MAJORITY DID NOT HAVE TO DIE!!!

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Quirkyfrog
Robert Cowling 12
This country has proudly passed the 150,000 death toll, and swaggering to 200,000. God Bless America, and Trump?

He now wants to 'delay' the election. So have all those people died to give him a reason (excuse) to stay in office? My blood ran cold when I thought that a sitting American president would encourage America citizens to die to prop up his weakness and fear that he would lose an election.

The economy is crap, we've lost any lead on saving any human life from this virus, and he has made a mess of the legacy of this country. He deserves to face an election, and he deserves to lose ALL 50 states, and be the first president that loses by a 90% margin! He has failed at every opportunity to lead the nation out of the ditch he recklessly drove the country into.

How many more American citizens have to die before people get a clue?
How far does the economy have to fall before people get a clue?
How much farther does the respect America had have to disappear before people get a clue?

A country run on hate is unsustainable! Eventually this country WILL fall, if he isn't stopped. And when it falls, then what? A fire sale to the world? Trump bankrupts America in more ways than one.

Wear a damn mask! Be an adult, be a person that believes others deserve to live. We are all in this together.
AndrewNZ
Andrew Bunker 1
If your President delay's the election he still cannot stay in office he has to obey the rules too.

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Kairho
Kairho Carroll 6
Countrywide the average age is 41.
tranderson2
Tommy Boy 3
That's a good statistic and an even better reaction to it. "Who cares? they're mostly OLD people. Grow the f up, a$$hole. People across the nation are dying in record numbers and those that survive will be scarred and recovering for years. You're and a$$hole. Did I mention that before? I don't mean to repeat myself, a$$hole.

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aggie57
Alister Grigg 15
Why do you Americans insist on making everything about politics? This is a virus, it doesn't vote and neither do the people who have died of it. Time for a change to forget about whether someone votes blue, red, pink, gold, whatever. Time to get organised and work as a team. That's why and how other countries (including Europe and Asia) are doing so much better than the US.
gtl846
Gord Lampman 9
In Canada it never became a political thing. Our Politicians put their differences aside, listened to scientists and worked together. Our hospital and testing clinics never got overwhelmed and our per captita rates are a fraction of the USA's
nk4091
Neil Klapthor 0
Please don't lump all Americans in with those whose brains are fried due to TDS.
tranderson2
Tommy Boy -2
TRUMP. That's why.
nk4091
Neil Klapthor -1
Berserk liberals still having a mouth-foaming tantrum over Hillary losing!! That's why.
cyberjet
cyberjet 8
Check your facts, new infections since things were opened up are predominantly in people under 40 and thousands of them are now in a hospital fighting for their lives and going bankrupt as the bills pile up.

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samueldemars
Sam DeMars 6
There you go politicizing. You can say Democrat this and Democrat that (I'm not one personally), but it isn't the Democrats who are mostly spreading conspiracy theories and misinformation. It's not the Democrats who are maligning mask wearing and turning it into a political litmus test. It's people like you. Like YOU. Not the liberals or the Democrats- people like YOU. Why don't you pull your head where the sun shines and discover what being a good citizen is? No, you'd rather wrap yourself in your "Don't Tread on me" flag and go cough in peoples paces in stores to show people nobody can tell you what to do. Grow up a little.
jm21783
James Meek 4
Yes, "COVID-19 deaths [are] well down the list of causes", because all over the world people are socially distancing and wearing masks -- especially the most vulnerable, the elderly, who are hyper-aware of the risks.

And so what if there were idiotic "DEMOCRATS" in New York giving bad advice?

And your argument that "the number of deaths actually caused by COVID-19 is 'much smaller' than the reported number" leaks like a sieve. If the percentage of Americans infected at any one time is, for example, 5%, then only 5% of deaths in which other factors might be present are misreported. (And what percentage of traffic death victims are being tested for coronavirus, when even the living have trouble getting a test?)

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/07/why-arent-we-talking-more-about-airborne-transmission/614737/
tranderson2
Tommy Boy -1
You're so full of BS I can smell you.

A serial killer rapes and kills 37 women. you say, "No big deal. 150,000 people die each day.
A mother and her baby get their heads torn off in a car accident and you say, "So what? 150,000 people die every day."
1,500 people die from COVID-19, half of which could have been prevented if everyone wore masks, and you say. "Who cares? 150,000 people die each and every day."

Do you understand how selfishly stupid you are? WE DO. So.... STFU.

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PDLanum
Philip Lanum 3
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.

Again and again.
Highflyer1950
Highflyer1950 70
What’s with these idiots? When you turn a plane around for non-compliance the F/a’s can note the seat, Pax id from the manifest and put them on the airlines.......”you‘re not flying today list & the next few years doesn’t look great either!”
TorstenHoff
Torsten Hoff 78
Also. not complying with the instructions of the cabin crew is a federal crime and can result in significant penalties. I hope a judge throws the book at those clowns.

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drbobm4
Robert Martin 21
What if a group of people decided that traffic lights were a conspiracy and refused to stop, asserting their "freedom" as the reason? Would you still drive? We obey laws so we can all live together.
coolhat
Cynde Sadler 1
The same can be said about clothing in general. Few complain that they are required by law to wear clothing in public and don't demand 'God-given' rights to walk naked on the streets. The masks are a temporary inconvenience that can save countless lives.
gretair
RG GR 9
Also well said. Accountability framework is a requirement for a well functioning society.
yr2012
matt jensen 1
For several years in Montana they didn't have a speed limit. There were fewer accidents than when they had a Federally mandated 55/65 law. Only after the feebs threatened to withold highway funds did the state institut a 75mph limit on the interstates and 65mph elsewhere.
mcgg
steve mcgrath 2
Sorry that's incorrect. The reasonable and prudent limit resulted in a large increase in highway deaths was eliminated as a result.
MurrayBeard
Murray Beard 2
The speed limit was "reasonable and prudent for traffic and weather conditions." Motorists didn't know what that meant and it was up to the discretion of police traffic enforcement to make those determinations. Turned out that people really wanted a speed limit. I believe it was first set at 85 on limited-access highways, but it may have been turned down to 75. Texas has a toll road between Austin and San Antonio with an 85 mph speed limit.
cyberjet
cyberjet 21
One question and it should be simple enough even for you - do you wear a seatbelt? I suspect you do and the reality is, you won’t need it most times you ride in a vehicle but they’re proven to save your life on that one occasion when you do. Same applies for masks, I may not need it today but on that day when I do, it only works when I’m wearing it. Besides, when I wear a mask, it’s as much about protecting YOU as it is me. Pull your head out of your back side and think of others for a change.
beilstwh
beilstwh 16
I see you have absolutely no idea what the masks are for. They are NOT to protect you from other people, they are to protect other people from YOU if you are asymptomatic. Whenever you breath or cough a fine mist of water particles shoot out of your mouth. If you are sick, the virus will be on those droplets. If someone breaths in the water droplet they can get infected. The mask traps the droplets in the mask so they don't fly out. The droplets will eventually fall to the floor but it takes about 6 feet before gravity pulls them to the ground.
PDLanum
Philip Lanum 4
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.
jesussmitharoo
The social contract in this country has been torn up and set on fire. We used to care about our countrymen and women, but now it is every man for himself. How sad that we have let this happen to a once great country.

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larrykreuger
Larry Kreuger 3
We have heard thIs same kind of malarkey about defying science and medicine by these deniers over and over again throughout history...not sure whether such defiance is the result of just not listening in school, selfishness, conservativeness, being duped by their media and those for whom they voted, susceptibility to conspiracy theories, religious beliefs, exposure to chemtrails, watching evangelical “pastors” and former game show hosts who’ve become experts on pandemics, or what? Maybe it’s a combination of some or all of the above.
beilstwh
beilstwh 9
I think it's mostly the dimming down of science education in our schools. When I went to school (a long time ago), we had civics and multiple science classes so we understood how society and nature actually worked.
larrykreuger
Larry Kreuger 4
good point.. my high school classes were from 1960-63.
JainaBrown
Jaina Brown 47
First rule of travel by air, don't mess with the cabin crew.

It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree, wearing a mask has become mandatory. Suck it up butter cup and deal with it.

Oh, and if by chance it actually helps the Covid situation, that would be a bonus. Let's keep America open and flying. If it's wearing a mask to do that, so be it.

Have my flights booked and ticketed. Seriously looking forward to a vacation.
cyberjet
cyberjet 20
It sure would help the cabin crew and their employers if the FAA would get off their arse and make masks mandatory on all passenger aircraft.
bobsnafu
Bob L 7
Totally agree. I too have a flight booked and looking forward to some vay-kay time.
PANATIVE
Anne Bracken 31
I flew with Delta two weeks ago. 4 flights were immaculately clean with all passengers masked. I hope and pray that things will get back to “normal” for frequent fliers like myself and for the airline industry. I understand the concept of individual liberty, but respect the rules of the airlines. It is not that bad to don a mask. Do it.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 12
You said the flights were immaculately clean and then said you hood and pray for things to get back to normal. I'm hoping the immaculately clean planes are the new normal.
PANATIVE
Anne Bracken 8
I certainly agree with you. I think “normal” is going to look very different as we navigate these times. I just wanted to commend Delta for its obvious hard work.
gtl846
Gord Lampman 44
I have live in Canada a short distance to the USA boarder and have travelled the USA. I now realize that I am understanding Americans less and less recently. It seems that so many think everything is a conspiracy. I don't like wearing a mask in the grocery store or on a flight but it makes my fellow citizens more comfortable. That's enough for me. A wise man once said "Love Your Neighbour". As long as the USA continues the way that it has in response to the virus I hope that our boarders will continue to be shut.
gretair
RG GR 12
Well said. In the flight training biz, there's a wise saying "cooperate ... graduate". Peeps, it's not that difficult.
phurford
Paul Hurford 27
Gord: I live in California, am a US Citizen and trust me... I'm understanding Americans less and less recently as well. It's really nuts here, and it is also the first time in my life I'm not so proud of being an American.
gtl846
Gord Lampman 1
I spent a lot of time in California in the late 80's with my uncle hiking the Sierras and was on Mt Whitney twice. I really love California.
scotthaycock
Scott Haycock 9
Gord, I also find that I'm understanding Americans less and less recently, and I live in Utah!
BeverlyCarter
Beverly Carter 7
Yes, you are correct yet unfortunately we have become a nation of conspiracy without theory. Five years ago those folks were on the fringe but no longer.
iaincmaciver
Iain Maciver 9
Totally agree. Also US border staff stationed at our airports are being totally disrespectful: numerous times now police have had to tell them to wear masks...

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gtl846
Gord Lampman 19
Your country might need advice from someone. Ive never been a Trudeau fan and won't defend his scandals but our politicians on both sides are smart enough to listen to real scientists. I am concerned about my own country. Thank You for illustrating why 90% of Canadians don't want Americans entering Canada.
fiala1
Joe Fiala 3
But an unwritten rule in the US is to never ever take advice from another country regardless of whether it is good or bad. The US is proud, an exception to all the rules of world, and independent free thinkers who would rather do something our own way even if it is wrong because it's our own way.
gtl846
Gord Lampman 3
Unfortunately it's not working well for the USA right now. Ive studied North American History since my university days 30+ years ago and unfortunately that type of thinking has often been the Achilles heel of the USA especially in politics and military. Thankfully it isn't always that way. I know that McMaster University (a top med school in Canada) shares a lot of research to the USA and has had a great influence on the way that medicine is taught.
fiala1
Joe Fiala 2
You're right that we will take a lot of information from others such as in medicine in education programs and that is acceptable because teaching helps boosts egos and makes student numbers increase. Everyone is a winner. There isn't a lot of money to be made in education. But the business of medicine is different and that is all about doing it the USA way to make as much money as possible or you cannot play the medicine game here. It doesn't matter to many decision makers if it doesn't work out in long run, as long as its done our own individual way for quick benefits. If the weather is hot today, then worry about global warming, but it is pleasant today then there is nothing to worry about.
SIERRA09
Ed Crist 17
Good for Delta, now charge these imbeciles for whatever it cost to turn around that flight. And reimburse the other passengers for their tickets. A little jail time would be appropriate.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 17
Weather you agree with wearing a mask or disagree with wearing a mask it is a policy that must be followed or you just don’t fly. I personally don’t like wearing them, but I do wear them wherever they are required.
CerealSpiller
Mike G 23
I think it would be somewhat odd if someone actually likes wearing a mask. But it is just something we need to do. Imagine if a surgeon was operating on someone with a compromised immune system (like someone on chemo), and decided wearing a mask during the procedure was uncomfortable. Would anyone think this is acceptable?
AbieshanG13
Knew this was gonna happen. Congrats to Delta for stepping up and enforcing it...it really helps!

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Chawklit
Lynne Giuliano 20
I am happy to read this. There are just too many selfish people in the US lately. The ‘entitled’!
LarryQB
LarryQB 15
I am so damn proud of Delta and American about taking the lead while the federal government has abdicated leadership.
dlwmiami
D. W. 23
I don't think it's so much about "loving your neighbor" (Mr. Lampman, below) as it is about being just basically, simply smart: Americans these days, as a group, are (1) know-it-alls, (b) smarter than science, they think (but in reality, way, way dumber) and (c) confrontational and mean-spirited, just for the hell of it. How else could a country have a boor/boob for a president?
Chockaday
Curt Hockaday 2
Unfortunately your assessment is right on, and it's a shame that it is this way now.

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PBADC3
PBADC3 8
You asked "What science?" Here's some good science that addresses exactly the issue you bring up about the earlier recommendation not to wear masks.

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/417906/still-confused-about-masks-heres-science-behind-how-face-masks-prevent

Keep in mind that "Lack of scientific evidence that they work" is not the same thing as "evidence that they do not work."

When there is a lack of evidence, you gather more evidence. That's what they did.

Now there is enough evidence that masks are effective at preventing transmission, so the CDC has updated their recommendations. Also, it's common sense. COVID spreads primarily when an infected person breathes out droplets of moisture from their lungs and someone else breathes them in. A mask can stop a lot of those droplets from getting into the air.

In science (and in life) you must be open to changing your mind when new facts become available. More people need to learn this lesson.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 2
A lot of the confusion and disagreement could have been avoided if the CDC and the WHO had not flip flopped allowed the map on the issue of masks. Common sense should be enough to know that a virus that is spread through people's breath can be at the very least reduced with a mask. But the CDC came out wishy washy and the WHO said Masks won't work at all. Instead of using science and common sense both organizations let politics get in the way, the WHO much more than the CDC. And this happened when both organizations had scientists within their organizations advocating masks right from the beginning.
edman610
ed lang 20
I really hope they kicked the non-masked idiots off the plane.
raleedy
ALLAN LEEDY 39
The way I read it, they landed first.
KicksOnRoute66
Roger Anderson 6
It seems they were taxiing in preparation for departure but returned to the gate. Not sure what happened, but from what it sounds like, the airline returned to prove a point that they would be kicked off. Looks like they complied and the flight pushed back for the 2nd time and departed without further incident.

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egutwillig
Eric Gutwillig 5
Your comment is totally incorrect by almost all measures of scientific fact. Please take your civic and moral responsibility to not post anti-mask comments that are not routed in fact.
548kdm7109
Kevin Morgan 11
I am so sick and tired of the attitudes of so many. Just like you I have a freedom well, and when you take away my right and possibly endanger my health becasue of your selfish you should have to pay a price too. Countries have found success in social distancing and many countri8es have re-opened there boarders except to Americans. I applaud the airlines actions but until a severe fine is imposed these people will continue to care only about themselves. Make these people pay the cost of turning the planer around and all other fees like flight crews pay, fuel cost and if passengers are late for connecting flight charges and maybe they will begin to understand. But until this country starts getting in peoples pockets and fining them they will never take this pandemic seriously and will continue to impose there careless acts on other peoples lives.
MarcoGodoy
Marco Godoy 4
It's not any more about wether masks can really protect us or not. It's about them being the minimum visible protection measure each one of us can take, a token of good will and a desire to show that we might care at least a bit about collective well being and not just our own sorry arses.
beilstwh
beilstwh 23
The idiots who refuse to wear masks should be put on the FAA's Do Not Fly list for a minimum of 1 year so they can't fly anywhere in the united states.

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pagheca
pagheca 8
so, if you don't like smoking, let the smokers smoke in cinemas, theatre and restaurants, and don't go there! Nice way to sort out problems...
watkinssusan
i am guessing these same people would honor the signs of n establishment that had postings saying "no shirt,no shoes,no service",so were they people believeing it viloates their "right" to possibly infect others,o were they afraid they would not be able to breathe???you cannot fix stupid can you,and would these same people say no to wering a seat belt or a life jacket if necessary??good for delta...!
jeffinsydney
jeff slack 10
I have posted everywhere about the signs that appeared in the early 60s across the USA that say no shirt no shoes no service........and how back in the day no one screamed about their rights; they complied. Now suddenly you will not don' a mask to enter a public space to protect others but you will make sure you are wearing a shirt and shoes........WTF America? Just because there is a circus in D.C. does not mean everyone needs their own ring.
Boodog710
Jack Carson 6
On St Croix in the US Virgin Islands, there are several restaurants with similar signs posted. No Shirt - No Shoes -No Problem.
yr2012
matt jensen 4
I will continue to fly privately - my grandson and I at the controls and NO MASKS
beilstwh
beilstwh 5
You have the total right to not wear masks and infect everyone around you if your flying your own private plane. If you on public transportation such as trains, planes, subways, buses your right to infect other people stops at your mouth.
yr2012
matt jensen 1
We also don't fly pax - just cargo
JMARTINSON
JMARTINSON 1
Just like Thelma and Louise.
eugenekranz56
Gene Kranz 0
and *me
eugenekranz56
Gene Kranz 1
And what about laws mandating use of seatbelts in cars? Was there an uproar then about violation of civil rights?
mutrock
Mark Kortum 0
The frog does not jump out of the pot when the heat is turned up gradually.
paultrubits
paul trubits 0
Yup! And they are still fighting about motorcycle riders wearing helmets.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

666adt
Those postings are in many cases the byproduct of a Department of Health regulation or law - government-imposed - not imposed by the private business.
unique44
Dre Lanc 1
Mask it or casket
jehoove1221
Jeff Hoover 5
I"m thinking they should get a bill for their share of the fuel and equipment use.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

Gorgonzola323
Why does the United States suffer a raging pandemic while most other countries have achieved an acceptable level of containment? The reason is we have a large population of bone dumb citizens like these two doofus. Stupidity is even more difficult to cure then Covid-19.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
Don't forget all the people out protesting or going to parties and the beach. Most countries slowed the spread with social distancing but that only works if people social distance. Masks can help reduce the spread but they still let particles and areosals past so they are not a replacement for social distancing, hand washing and common sense.
WhiteKnight77
WhiteKnight77 1
People here in the US would balk at doing what the Chinese allegedly did. They welded the doors of apartment buildings shut so no one could go in or out.
rossselvidge
Ross Selvidge 5
All airlines should ban from future flights on that airline any passenger who refuses to mask-up. That is legal! The passenger knows the rule ahead of time. In an airplane, rules rule.
sawhill
Sheila Kimle 5
Good for you Delta, I really don’t know what people are thinking. We are in a Pandemic. The sooner people realize how serious COVID 19 is and start wearing a mask, the sooner we will see a decline in new cases. It’s a temporary inconvenience ant it will prevent further spread. Be kind and respectful to one another during this difficult time.
trumanlewis
Truman Lewis 2
Throw the bastards off. That just stupid not to wear a mask, rules are rules, you gotta stop at red lights to, yet another rule and I bet they stop at it
4gloriajohns
Gloria Johns 2
How many ways can we spell "whether," as in whether or not. I've seen wether, weather waether.
MikeMauldwin
Mike Mauldwin 2
Did Delta ban them for life and pass their names along to other carriers. That would be great, in both cases. The business owner has the right to set standards in their place of business - regardless of a client's personal beliefs....
fredp17
good idea but then again I'm sure someone would complain about rights
keywestjj
I agree 100% with this and wouldn't think of getting on an airliner without a mask ... OR go into a store or gas station or ... THAT SAID ... I also will probably never fly on an airline again in my life after the abuse of the last two decades with the cancelled flights and missed connections and surly employees and just general disrespect. If I can't drive or fly my own little Cherokee ... I don't need to go.
n555cf
rbt schaffer 2
Throw them out D B Coopers door... Too bad they don't have them today
jm21783
James Meek 4
Regarding the "Association of American Physicians and Surgeons (AAPS)", the group's name makes gives the impression that it is a prestigious organization like the American Medical Society, whose advice is here:
https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-aha-ana-release-psa-urging-masks-stop-covid-19-spread
This article is also excellent:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/07/why-arent-we-talking-more-about-airborne-transmission/614737/

My daughter is a doctor and has an ample supply of horror stories about complete jerks she's encountered in the profession. Note that the "AAPS" membership is only about 5,000, less than 1% of American physicians.
This unmasks the AAPS:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_American_Physicians_and_Surgeons
PBADC3
PBADC3 5
The AAPS also says that HIV does not cause AIDS, that being gay reduces life expectancy, that there is a link between abortion and breast cancer, and that there is a causal relationship between vaccines and autism.
fredp17
Good for you Delta and as a pilot, passenger and firefighter, agree all have to play by the rules and cut out the selfish attitude. No wonder why the positive cases in states are up again. My NY had held true and doing well.
vfmorton
Good for Delta! I am happy that someone , down UNDER, is taking a firm stand in helping to curb the spread of this deathly virus!
skogey
skogey 3
Good job Delta!
pthomas745
Pa Thomas 4
Nice to know that "multiple" now means "two".
KicksOnRoute66
Roger Anderson 2
I wondered the same
raleedy
ALLAN LEEDY 2
Two is not a "multiple" of anything other than itself and one.
DaveGarvey
Dave Garvey 2
5 microns
crkdoug
Can passengers on this flight who suffered financial loss due to the return to Romulus sue these 2 deplorable for damages?

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

n555cf
rbt schaffer 2
The only reason YOUR 'face diaper' seems so useless is it is so full of sh it
TheDogeof88
Chuck Lavazzi 2
Good for them. It's clearly going to be up to individual airlines to protect the health of their customers since nothing positive can be expected from this administration. Don't like it? Don't fly. Freedom of choice and all that.
TroyJrPearson
FEED THE TREES
THEY LOVE
CARBON MONOXIDE
YOUR BODY DOESN’T
tjd1969
Tim Duggan 1
It's very simple people. As the sign says: "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Service" we must add to that No Mask. An airline is a BUSINESS. AND also, NOT complying with a crewmember's orders is A FELONY!!!
Aadeeb
Adel Adeeb 1
Good luck
RexBentley
Rex Bentley 1
Never seen so many smart dumb people all together in one place.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
I guess you never use social media. This is pretty tame compared to Facebook and Twitter.
jefirdjr
Jack Efird 1
Why didn't Delta check ALL passengers for agreement to wearing a mask BEFORE the flight even left the terminal?
Could have avoided this entire incident?
a1brainiac
a1brainiac 1
I guess they never wanted to get to Atlanta
sconklan
sconklan 1
I see Karens abound on here too.
ADXbear
ADXbear 1
Send them the return cost.. jerks
cobra774
David Morgan 1
I’m sure it was the same when they started the no smoking policy on board.
WhiteKnight77
WhiteKnight77 1
If people board wearing a mask, then take it off at any time, depending on where they are at, Either turn around, land at the nearest airport, or continue on, then ban them from future flights by putting them on no-fly lists.
n82221
Dave Hahn 1
Just an observation. Based on all the “ down votes ,etc” it is obvious the face mask thing especially on aircraft is a hot button. Wonder if it is equally as decisive on the ground where “ distancing “ is more available
ChriLennard
Chris Lennard 0
Gosh, Americans. What's wrong with you all.....
ko25701
ko25701 1
Detroit is darn near Canada, we don't claim Michigan in the south.
666adt
Andrew Turnbull -3
Well, just keep in mind, if it weren't for us you'd be speaking German or Japanese today. We're still the reason there even IS a free world out there.

Imagine no America...what do you think China and Russia would be doing right now?

I'll take America and its robust freedoms - including the freedom to think independently of our "experts" who said in March that masks weren't necessary for the general public but who now say we can wear any ol' thing (I wonder how many deaths they caused by not telling us in MARCH to wear any ol' thing??) - over any other country on the planet.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

hortod1
dj horton 10
The only Karen here is you... repeating the same thing over and over and over and over and over again

You seem to think you’re clever - you’re not.

Move along little doggie
beilstwh
beilstwh 5
I asked Flight aware admin to do something about him. cut and pasting the same false statement over, and over, and over is spamming the community
mikeenderle
Michael Enderle -6
Agreed. Unfortunately this forum is filled with sheep incapable of finding information beyond the mainstream media.
jeffinsydney
jeff slack -5
If the USA would have done lockdown on March 25th with the rest of us.......but then there is a clown in charge...........you would be open, well and truly open for business now.
ko25701
ko25701 6
By March 25th the virus was already spread out of control. Much too late to matter.
mlinds
Mitchell Linds 0
Good on Delta .... but I would have assumed those 2 idiots boarded the plane without masks and if that was the case, the flight should never had departed thus dealing with the problem prior to flight ??

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

waypoint66
David Rice 5
Enrique Silva - will you please hand prop my airplane? Whoops! Feet slipped off the brakes. Too bad, so sad.
JoelRugeno
Joel Rugeno 8
Dumbass
PDLanum
Philip Lanum 2
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.

This is getting tiresome - again and again.
daetchevtex
David Thompson -4
Another fine example of government overreach. Up until May 3, someone could fly anywhere in the country without a mask on. However, once the government bailout took effect, wearing masks became mandatory on nearly EVERY SINGLE AIRLINE on the VERY SAME DAY, May 4! Southwest and American chose May 11 as the mandatory start date. Once the airlines announced this requirement, why didn't they enforce it prior to May 4 or May 11? As a retired pilot, I am very familiar with the regs requiring passengers to comply with crewmember instructions: however, I've seen much worse violations posted on this very site that did not result in an aircraft being turned around. Just a couple of questions for those of you who think the "science" supports mask wearing. If masks are so effective, why are the number of cases increasing? If someone is not infected or has recovered from the virus, how can they pass it to someone else? What about someone who has a medical reason that prevents them from wearing a mask? Lastly, if the airlines will not allow me to fly without a mask, they don't need my business.
wjm100
In answer to your questions:
The reason that the number of cases is increasing is that too many people are not wearing masks when they should.
It makes no sense to say that you don't need to wear a mask if you are not infected because about half of all transmission occurs before people know they are infected, and wearing a mask also helps prevent you from getting it from someone else (and then passing it on).
If a person has a medical reason for not wearing a mask, the airlines will accept documentation to that effect.
If you are unwilling to fly with a mask the airlines do not want your business because you will contribute to their sensible passengers getting sick, which is worse than losing the business of just one troublesome passenger.
But don't take my word for it, the scientific literature is full of studies of how this disease is transmitted. And if you don't believe in science, how do you explain why aircraft can fly?
tyketto
Then apparently you will never be flying. Because, it isn't the airlines saying that you will not fly without a mask. THE LAW is. And that law - the ability to mandate - is backed by SCOTUS. If you are a pilot, then you should have been more than familiar with the Air carrier Access Act, and what things an airline may allowed to do or be limited from doing.

I'd suggest that you read up on that, as well as a refresher in what you think you know about this pandemic versus what is known about it, especially with regards to being symptomatic versus asymptomatic, as well as being a carrier for the virus, despite having recovered for it.

Additionally, read up on Typhoid Mary. That will put every single argument you have to bed.
FortWorthFlyer
Keith Price 0
Don't care what they do as long as I don't have to bail them out! Oops, they did steal my tax dollars . . . Oh Well

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

Mixie
WHO did say that earlier on. Clearly a mistake. They then changed their position once scientific evidence came to light.
Infections may be in the lower or upper respiratory system. Lower leads to symptoms of cough, making it "symptomatic". Symptoms of upper may be dry throat, touch of fever and some other easily ignore signs ("barely symptomatic") -- or none. Yet, while talking or breathing heavily viruses will be expelled. How far, in what quantity, how long they survive, how likely is a third person to be contaminated are still debated among professionals. So you could argue those points, but you can't argue that virus will be expelled by an asymptomatic or barely symptomatic person in the seats next to you.
ko25701
ko25701 3
Next time you have surgery the doctor can just skip the mask?
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
Here's a little study on masks...
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
666adt
Your comment proves Dave K's point - your ignorance about masks is profound.

So I guess the next time YOU have surgery, the doctor can wear a repurposed bandanna as a mask? Or maybe a torn up t-shirt or a neck gaiter? Maybe Alysa Milano's crocheted mask?

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

PDLanum
Philip Lanum 0
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.

Again and again and again.

How does it feel to be so wrong?
LarryBass
Larry Bassett -1
I flew earlier this week, and every aspect of social distancing was in play... Check-in, Waiting area, middle row of seats unused... masks on everyone. UNTIL THE PLANE landed, at which point it became a sardine can when everybody jumped up and retrieved their bags from the overhead bins and planted themselves on top of each other in the aisle waiting for the door to open (10 minutes) so they could deplane. Since a chain is as strong as it's weakest link... let's quit the charade and let things get back to normal.
pagheca
pagheca 2
I don't think so. Exposure must be prolonged, that's what research said, to expose to high risk. So, 10 mins waiting, with mask on, expose less respect to a maybe 8 hours flights sitting close or behind someone infected not wearing a mask.
666adt
Andrew Turnbull -8
"Many in both our political and media classes, however, have no desire for people to be well informed about relative risks. People who are afraid, after all, will engage in socially demanded behaviors. So why risk giving them an accurate picture of their situation? Politicians and the media are not informing the public so much as managing it, an impulse we must call out and fight.

We should also resist the ratcheting effect of a growing culture of safetyism, most excellently discussed in an UnHerd article by Matthew Crawford. He writes, “At the level of sentiment, there appears to be a feedback loop wherein the safer we become, the more intolerable any remaining risk appears. At the level of bureaucratic grasping, we can note that emergency powers are seldom relinquished once the emergency has passed.”"

Be an informed, free citizen, not a subject. Read the whole thing here: https://bit.ly/3ggCtXr
tyketto
Practice what you preach. Read up on Typhoid Mary, and Jacobsen v. Massachusetts. Be informed, not subject to conspiracies.
RexBentley
Rex Bentley -4
One more strap in the harness of tyranny that's being fashioned for you.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

cyberjet
cyberjet 7
Someone doesn’t understand how filtration works. Here’s a hint - it’s not about stopping every virus particle from getting through, it’s about stopping enough of them to reduce the risk. It takes about 2000 virus particles to create a new infection. Masks stop enough particles to reduce the concentration in air so the recipient doesn’t breathe in that many.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
Here's a little study in masks...

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
beilstwh
beilstwh 5
The masks are NOT to protect you, The masks are to protect other people from YOU
Viperguy46
Jesse Carroll -2
Please forgive the Democrats! They don't know what they do:
JosieRojas
Josie Rojas 0
Hurray for Delta!
gavron
Ehud Gavron -9
Delta can have their policy and more power to them. However, the Federal Air Regulations don't say anyone "has to comply with crewmember instructions" except for smomking.

I know flight attendants like to claim that WE ALL MUST COMPLY, but FARS 91.1035(1) Smoking says: "...and require compliance with crewmember instructions with regard to these items;"

You'll note that masks are not in the FARS. Again, as I said, Delta can have their own policy and more power to them but I CAN'T IMAGINE the cost in time, inconvenience to 100+ people, crew, pilots, ground support. Why not just have the police meet the two people at the destination and harass them for 24 hours?

E
pagheca
pagheca 3
because in the meanwhile some PAX or crews may have got infected with Covid, for example?
gavron
Ehud Gavron 0
I agree and am always wearing my mask out. However, these two a-holes were already seated, breathing on pax, crews, touching armrests, etc. The damage was done.

Maybe if someone takes off their mask they get escorted and locked in the aft lav?
pagheca
pagheca 1
I am afraid you cannot afford turbulence or landing with people in the afta lav... I guess they did on purpose like "so, now people knows what may happen if they do not comply with our policy".
sconklan
sconklan -6
Stupid to turn flight around. Just proceed to destination then cite the customers if you must.
beilstwh
beilstwh 7
so your saying that the other passengers should just accept being infected by Covid-19 because the poor snowflakes shouldn't be kicked off the flight
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
That horse was already out of the barn. If these two were infected then everyone on the flight was already exposed.
brentaustinlee
Brent Lee -3
Perhaps offer mask optional flights with waivers for those of us that like to live on the edge...
bryanpennington
Like Jim says here, masks are mostly to protect other people. They mostly stop the water vapor/droplets from leaving your immediate area. Did you know that you can be contagious for almost two weeks before symptoms present? That's two weeks of contagious spread without knowledge. Two weeks of spread to people who might not be as healthy as you are. Masks are best at reducing the transmission rates, not to you, but from you.

If I was a flight crew member and I was asked to work a flight that was mask optional, there would be a fast "HELL NO!" response from me. The thought of being locked into a metal tube with 150-300 people possibly spreading COVID in an enclosed space just so they can be selfish and risk MY life... no thanks. Go be selfish in a car by yourself. It's just a mask.
jimshilliday
Jim Shilliday 4
Doesn't work, because even if mask-wearing passengers were willing to take the risk, you can't subject the flight crew to that risk. Remember that masks are to protect other people, not just the wearer.
AWAAlum
AWAAlum -1
The virus can't be stopped as long as only some of the people do what's required. This is massive, and requires absolute compliance.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

PA32R300
W B johnson 9
Sure! And the same for seatbelt laws and speed limits in school zones, concessions for the physically disabled, having to serve Blacks in your restaurant, mandatory primary education, and...I could on and on about expensive laws designed to protect other people from selfish thoughtless people.
Geldridge
Gary Eldridge -7
It is quite ridiculous to mandate the wearing of masks as they do no good in preventing the spread of viruses. Viruses penetrate right through a face mask although they are good bacterial blocks which is why we use them in patient settings. But against a virus they are absolutely no good. When wearing them for long durations they reduce your blood oxygen level and compromise your own immune system. Don’t wear them! There’s so much false information out there. The best thing is to wash hands often and careful what you touch. Face masks will not save you. That’s a farce.
TheDogeof88
Chuck Lavazzi 4
That's total rubbish. Here are some facts courtesy of the Mayo Clinic (although they're also available elsewhere):https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449

That said, there's certainly plenty of false information out there. As you have just demonstrated.
jimshilliday
Jim Shilliday 4
No one should believe this. Face masks catch droplets that contain viruses. Please show us your peer-reviewed evidence that they don't help, thank you.
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
This is peer reviewed...

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
TimDyck
Tim Dyck 1
Here is a good read, peer reviewed unlike Chuck's mayo clinic peice...

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0843-2
LRPenner
Lonnie Penner -1
Ladies and gents, on this flight you will be required to wear a mask. You can either wear it properly, on your face, or we will strap one on your back and open the cabin door at FL330... but you WILL wear a mask.
Way to go, Delta!

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

PDLanum
Philip Lanum 3
If masks do not protect, then why do surgeons where them?

They wear them so the surgeon does not spit into the open wound and contaminate the field. By wearing a mask you lower the "spit" you produce by breathing and talking and therefore you limit the ability to pass on the virus to others - especially if you are asymptomatic.

If everyone would wear a mask when they are out and about, the spread of the virus would be significantly curtailed.

If you are going to repeat the same old drivel, I will respond with facts and data.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

samueldemars
Sam DeMars 9
He wasn't giving advice. Read more and react less. And you go ahead and enjoy your freedom to infect people. What heroic ideals you have.
gtl846
Gord Lampman 6
You probably do need some advice since the USA cannot control the virus. I am an average Canadian. Here we don't raise our political leaders to the level of cult leaders like some Americans have done with Trump. Personally I have never been a Trudeau fan nor did I vote for his party. I will give the politicians from all parties credit for not making the science of the virus a political issue. Just so you know the virus is not a Democrat hoax that the whole world is in on to make Trump look bad. He's been doing that to himself for years. Yes I am concerned about the USA. I have many good friends in the USA and would like to see them again at some point. I do not want them sick because of ridiculous conspiracy theories. To date Canada has had 115 799 cases 8929 deaths. Hospitals were never overwhelmed. The USA is at 4 541 016 cases and 152 922 deaths and rising. I live near Niagara Falls where we welcome the world. However, since some Americans are more concerned about fighting with each other Its probably not the time to have visitors from the USA. About 90% of Canadians want the border to remain shut because we don't trust our neighbours. I too like the motto of of New Hampshire but I don't fear that my freedom is at risk by wearing a mask on a flight. It may be protecting the rights to health of another citizen. I don't dwell in fear. In my career I have run towards gunfire to keep others safe. I don't claim to be the smartest man but I am smart enough to listen to real doctors and scientists and not the demon doctor of Houston as Trump does.

[This comment has been downvoted. Show anyway.]

PDLanum
Philip Lanum 2
You are simply wrong. I hope you get thrown off the next airplane you attempt to get on.
patatefrite
And of course you are a doctor !!!!
claudelucente
claudelucente -1
You are sadly misinformed. Everyone needs to do their part. If you really need to have a "what's in it for me" reason, the economy for one. Wait... if it recovers too quickly we may get 4 more years. Hmmm, maybe I should stop wearing a mask.
DRotten
D Rotten -9
Now, THIS is VERY interesting!
Association Of American Physicians And Surgeons Sounds Off On Face Masks
https://www.technocracy.news/association-of-american-physicians-and-surgeons-sounds-off-on-face-masks/
jm21783
James Meek 4
Regarding the "Association of American Physicians and Surgeons (AAPS)", the group's name makes gives the impression that it is a prestigious organization like the American Medical Society, whose advice is here:
https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-aha-ana-release-psa-urging-masks-stop-covid-19-spread
This article is also excellent:
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/07/why-arent-we-talking-more-about-airborne-transmission/614737/

My daughter is a doctor and has an ample supply of horror stories about complete jerks she's encountered in the profession. Note that the "AAPS" membership is only about 5,000, less than 1% of American physicians.
This unmasks the AAPS:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_American_Physicians_and_Surgeons
PBADC3
PBADC3 4
The AAPS also says that HIV does not cause AIDS, that being gay reduces life expectancy, that there is a link between abortion and breast cancer, and that there is a causal relationship between vaccines and autism.
samueldemars
Sam DeMars 3
This is all about risk reduction. Anything short of Bioseafety Level 4 hazard suits is less than foolproof against COVID-19. For political reasons and from prescribing to quack conspiracy theories, there's been a lot of spreading of doubt, misinformation, and disinformation about masks. There's no doubt that they help slow the spread of COVID-19. Whether they help a lot or a little shouldn't matter as the inconvenience and expense are small. Only the completely selfish political fanatics and paranoiacs focus exclusively on the shortcomings of the masks and other precautions being taken.

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